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外国网民评论:韩国人后悔抛弃汉字吗? [美国quora]

五毛网 其他 2017年04月30日 来源:五毛网

原文地址:https://www.quora.com


o Koreans regret abandoning Hanja?


韩国人后悔抛弃汉字吗?


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外国网民评论:

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Lee Wee Hian studied at University of California Los Angeles

upxed Jan 19 2016 R26; Upvoted by Paul Denlinger

This is a pretty divisive issue in South Korea. There are 2 schools of thought on this issue in contemporary South Korea. Some are pro-Hanja proponents who want to reintroduce Hanja mixed scxt into everyday life while others are anti-Hanja proponents who want to retain Hangul exclusivity (often by lixing Hanja usage to Japanese colonial rule to stoke nationalist fervor).


在韩国这是一个相当有争议性的话题。当代韩国在这个问题上分成两派。挺汉字的一派想再引入汉字,在日常生活中使用汉谚同书,而反汉字的一派想保留谚文的排外性。(经常将汉字的使用同日本殖民统治联系在一起,从而挑起民族主义情绪)

译者注:现在韩国的文字叫谚文,作用相当于拼音,汉谚同书就是汉字和谚文一起使用。


The fact of the matter is that Hangul cannot distinguish homonyms in a way that Hanja can (Korean is replete with Sino-Korean words that are often pronounced the same but carry different meanings). Consequently South Korea has one of the developed world's highest functional illiteracy rates.[1] As such Koreans often use Hanja dictionaries like Naver to disambiguate meanings.[2]


恢复汉字原因在于谚文无法区分同形同音词,而汉字可以。谚文包含了多个汉字,通常发音一样但有许多完全不同含义。所以韩国是发达世界中文盲率最高的国家之一。[1]因此,韩国人经常使用像Naver这样的汉韩字典来消除歧义。[2]


译者注:废除汉字仅留下纯谚文的韩文相当于只写拼音,例如只写着Liyu,人们看不懂,不知道指是鲤鱼,理喻,李煜,礼遇,俚语还是利于。有时只能结合上下文猜意思,所以韩国人因为无法理解谚文的真正意思变成了文盲)



Also Hangul exclusivity has effectively thwarted Koreans' access to their own history (most Korean works well into the 1960s were written in Classical Chinese or mixed scxt). South Korean Newspapers well into the 1970s continued to use mixed scxt. Here's a newspaper dated to October 28 1972 from the prominent Chosun Ilbo (朝鮮日報) with headlines and articles written in mixed scxt:


此外谚文的排外性明显地堵死了韩国人去探究自己历史通路。大部分60年代之前历史文献是由繁体字或者汉谚同书方式记录。韩国70年代的报纸大多依旧是汉谚同书。下面是一份著名的朝鲜日报,日期为1972年10月28日,它的标题和内容都是汉谚同书:


Kuiwon a native Korean speaker makes a pretty compelling case to reintroduce Hanja usage in South Korea because of Hangul's limitations especially in higher education. More here: Articles


一个叫Kuiwon(歸源)韩国本土人的博客,因为谚文特别在高等教育上的局限性,正尝试用相当吸引人的方式在想在韩国恢复使用汉字。 推荐文章。。。


译者注:Kuiwon是笔名,博主用繁体字,英语,韩语 三种语言翻译了许多中国古典文学。

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Jihyun Sohn lives in South Korea

Written 20h ago

Yes and no.


后悔,也不后悔。


I used to learn Hanja in elementary school - I remember taking a grade 7 qualification exam and failing dreadfully. I still know about 200 to 300 characters enough to recognise the really basic ones (I mean come on. It’s not exactly easy to forget how to read or write ‘一’ or ‘二’). The hardest Hanja I know how to write is probably the ones in my name 孫智賢.


我在小学学过汉字,我记得参加过汉语水平7级考试而且考得一趟糊涂。我仍然认得200-300个汉字,这足以识别特别基本的了。(我说行了,忘记去读写“一”或者“二”并不容易。)

我所能写出的最复杂的汉字大概就是我的名字-孫智賢.


*I’m guilty of having failed this exam


当年没通过考试,我于心有愧。


Hanja is actually pretty good to know - a lot of Hanja words show up in the Korean language and it’s not too hard to find a word outright written in Hanja when you read the news or certain books. Not to mention Hanja itself is useful if one wants to learn Chinese - and most Koreans do take Chinese as a second foreign language. God knows I’ve opened up and bought Hanja books in the hopes I will magically find the motivation and time to actually work on studying it.


学习汉字其实是非常有用的--许多汉字在韩语都有出现。当你看报道和读某些书时,并不难发现一些直接用汉字标识的词。不提如果有人想学中文,汉字十分有用-大部分韩国人把中文单做第二外语,上帝知道我已经踏出一步并且买了汉字教科书,希望我能奇迹般找到动力和时间去付诸实际行动专研它。



Then again there’s a reason I don’t actually find the motivation to study it. Hanja is hard. There’s so many characters you have to memorise and I’m not going to deny the general Korean method of studying Hanja - writing the characters with the Korean pronunciations next to them over and over again - is rather tedious. There’s so many things I could do during that time including scrolling through facebook shifting through Quora cafe-hopping with friends reading webtoons finding books to read without actually reading them…well you get the point.


然而,我实在没有动力去学习它的原因是, 汉字太难了。那么多单词需要去记忆,我不排除用韩国人的老方法去学习汉字- 用谚文在旁边一遍又一遍的注音- 这相当繁琐。在此期间有很多更有趣的东西召唤着我,包括浏览facebook,在跳转到Quora溜达,和朋友去咖啡馆消磨时光,在webtoons看漫画,或者找本书装B虽然可能一字也看不见去。。。你懂的。


Yes some Koreans do regret the intellectual possibilities Hanja could have brought it. However most of us do pretty fine without it. Hanja is mostly like a ‘bonus’ for us - it’s awesome if you know it but there’s no reason you actually should bother with knowing that many. It’s like knowing someone who knows how to read another language - you’re definitely jealous they can read it but you don’t really want to put in the work of studying it yourself.


是的,一些韩国人的确遗憾失去汉字带来的一些智力加分。然而我们中的大部分对废除它感到神清气爽。

汉字对我们来说就像“奖金”,如果你懂,那可真棒,但也没理由去自找麻烦去了解那么多。

就像知道某人能阅读另一种语言-而你不会,这当然十分让人嫉妒,然而你并不会一股脑的自己跑去学习它。


As for me I certainly want to get on with my Hanja studies…just let me look through Quora for a bit longer……


至于我,当然汉字学习还会继续下去。。。在这之前先让我在Quora再呆一小会。。。。。。:D


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Derek Park lives in South Korea

Written Apr 15

No.

Instead we celebrate our own writing system because it is much more convenient.

Hanja (or the Chinese writing system) has over 50000 characters all with different meanings. In contrast Hangeul (the Korean writing system) has only 28 characters and is phonetic like English.

I am very glad that I don't have to learn 50000 something characters to communicate. Don't your writing system requires at least the knowledge of over 1000 characters for basic communication?


不后悔。 相反我们为自己的书写体系庆贺,因为它方便得多了。

汉字(或者中国书写体系)有超过50000个不同意义的字符。相反韩文(韩国书写体系)只有28个字母并且发音更像英文。

我非常高兴不需要学习5w字用于沟通。 你们的书写体系会要求你至少认识超过1000字才能进行简单交流吗?



With Hangeul as the main character Hanja's only remaining purpose is to clarify homonyms. We only need to know couple of dozens for basic understanding and maybe a 200~500 for more complex things but that's it. Hardly anyone tries to learn over 500 and most forget their Hanja knowledge and end up understanding only about 100 or 200.

Also Hanja is a pain in the ass to write. It is just too detailed and even one wrong dot could mean a whole new thing.

Why did you make such a thing? It is so difficult.


随着谚文变成主文字,汉字保留下来的意义只有辨识同音字,我们只需要知道40多个字进行基础理解,如果想理解更复杂的事物只需学习200-500个字即可,这些已经足够。

几乎没人会试着学习超过500个字,大部分会忘记汉字知识并且最终只能理解100-200个。

而且汉字写起来十分蛋疼。 太多条条框框,一旦错了一笔,意思可能完全不同。

怎么会创造出这种东西? 太反人类了。

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Sang Young Noh I am Korean

Written Fri

This Korean does for two reasons.


我这个韩国人感到后悔,原因有二。


Firstly I find the Hanja scxture to be beautiful - I am not nationalistic or batshit crazy enough to think that a country should totally abandon what is a sino-influenced past and the addition of hanja in the Korean language is a nice spice to the language that is Korean.


第一,汉谚同书十分美观-我并不民族主义或者疯狂蛮横到认为一个国家应该彻底摒弃被汉文化影响的过去。

而且韩文因附加上汉字增色了不少,有了它才是真正的韩文。


Secondly and more importantly many many words in Korea are based on Hanja phrases and by knowing the meaning of the Hanja and the context of the sentence it is easier to figure out what the vocabulary in question means. Without the guidance of Hanja this means that the word pool of people in Korea shrinks and hence the literacy rate in Korea dwindles with it.


第二 更重要的是谚语中许多单词是基于汉字词组发展而来。通过了解汉字的含义和句子语境,更容易找出未解词汇的意思。没有汉字引导意味着韩国人的词汇量的缩减小,随之在韩国的识字率也会不断地减少。


Hence I would support any resurgence of Hanja.


因此我会支持汉字复苏。


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Chi Kyu Lee studies at Cornell University (2020)

Written Jul 7 2015

Hmmmm I don't think so. Although many Korean words can be traced back to Chinese characters (70%!) it was extremely inefficient to use Chinese characters for Korean before Hangul was invented. This is why only the upper class was able to learn how to read or write in Joseon Dynasty (1392-1897). King Sejong who invented Hangul is considered as one of Korea's most respected individuals today.

Yes it is true that Chinese characters are sometimes used to clarify homonyms or represent an abstract idea. However I've only seen them on media and old literature. Newspapers often use them for abbreviations for countries (for instance 美 for America or 中 for China). In fact many young Koreans today don't learn (or simply dabble on) Hanja or Chinese characters. Even if they do it's often exclusively for educational purposes not for practical purposes.

Personally I'm glad that I don't have to use Hanja. Hangul is made for the Korean language but Hanja was made for the Chinese languages.


唔 不认为会后悔。 尽管许多谚文可以追溯回汉字(有70%那么多)。在谚文被创造出来前,使用汉字对韩国人来说是非常低效的。这就是为什么在朝鲜王朝时期 (1392-1897)只有上层阶级能够学习阅读和书写汉字。 世宗大王因发明了谚文被认为是韩国的现今最受尊敬伟人之一。

是的,中文有时被用来辨识同音字或代表一个抽象的概念是事实。然而我只能在媒体或者旧文献看到它。报纸上经常用来缩写国家(如美代表美利坚合众国,中代表中华人民共和国)

事实上,许多韩国年轻人今天不再学习(或简单地涉足)汉字或中文。就算他们学,往往是仅仅用于教育目的不是基于实用的目的。

就个人来说,我很开心不必去学汉字,因为谚文是为韩语创造,而汉字是为中文而创造出来的。


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Didier Szende PhD dropout in Korean linguistics.

Written Jul 8 2015

It's hard to regret something you didn't actively do. Most Koreans under 40 never learned Chinese characters and they didn't abandon them as they never had them.


人们不会去后悔放弃一些他们不曾积极去做的东西。

大部分40岁以下韩国人从没学过一个中文,不曾拥有,又何来放弃?


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